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Hilo and Linux

Printed From: Lynx Studio Technology, Inc.
Category: Lynx Forum
Forum Name: Lynx Support Forum
Forum Description: Discussions about Lynx Hardware & Software
URL: https://www.lynxstudio.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=6252
Printed Date: June/25/2022 at 4:02am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.04 - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: Hilo and Linux
Posted By: JohnWalker
Subject: Hilo and Linux
Date Posted: September/21/2016 at 11:02am
I'm also using the Hilo as part of an active speaker set up, and have a couple of software requests.  JRiver Mediacenter 21 does the filtering; the Hilo's Mon outputs handle mid/treble, and bass signals are sent over the AES output to a Benchmark DAC-1. Line-in is used for analogue input, and line-out feeds a Stax headphone amp for late night listening. Different Hilo scenes handle the different signal routing necessary for each application. I like the flexibility that Hilo gives me; it's not far off being a perfect digital pre-amp.

Request 1: I'm using the Hilo under Windows 10 but only 'under protest'! I'd much rather use Linux. I gave up with RME gear because they would not support open source, and was disappointed that the Hilo did not work on Ubuntu when the sales material indicated that it should.  If you could find the engineering time, could you rectify the incompatibility between the Hilo and alsa's USB audio class2 implementation, please?

Request 2: I'd like a 'one touch' mute control for multiple channels. It would be nice to control both Mon-out and AES-out levels with the Hilo, but I appreciate that they are operating in different signal domains.  


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Retired UW acoustics engineer



Replies:
Posted By: David A Hoatson
Date Posted: September/21/2016 at 12:39pm
Hello,

I have moved your post to a new thread as this is a new question.

1) The Hilo-USB is completely USB Audio 2.0 class compliant.  The evidence of this is that the Hilo-USB requires no extra driver on Macintosh OS X, as OS X supports USB Audio 2.0 class directly.  No where in any of the sales material does it say we support Ubuntu.  I would more likely guess that the problem is with the Ubuntu USB Audio 2.0 class driver.  Of course we don't do any testing with Ubuntu.

2) Added to the wish list... you may not have to wait very long on this one. Smile


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Thank you,

David A. Hoatson
Lynx Studio Technology, Inc.
Co-founder, Chief Software Engineer


Posted By: JohnWalker
Date Posted: September/21/2016 at 1:43pm
David
thanks for replying so quickly. I appreciate that in the Pro Audio world, OSX and Windows are the big beasts you have to support. Nevertheless, I feel I have to challenge your assertion that you are completely compliant because you have a solution that works with just one vendor!

In my professional life, one thing I learned very quickly was that a standard was only a standard if it was supported by multiple suppliers. In the nineties (when I was doing this kind of work) I encouraged my software teams to regularly port their code between Unix, Windows and Linux as the only way to ensure that we weren't going to become stove-piped into one supplier's implementation. I think I even had a Mac which could run our code as well, between crashes.

Linux/open source developers put a huge amount of effort into their products, and test against as many hardware implementations as they can. Many internet standards  were, and still are first implemented using open source. Wouldn't it be worth Lynx sparing a few hours of time to investigate why the Hilo does not register the right number of channels when it is plugged into a Linux PC, and investigate whether a solution is possible?


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Retired UW acoustics engineer


Posted By: David A Hoatson
Date Posted: September/21/2016 at 2:53pm
The great thing about standards is there are so many of them!

It is simply not the case that we work with only one vendor.  We work on Windows using a USB 2.0 Audio class compliant driver and on OS X using a USB Audio 2.0 class compliant driver in addition to iOS using a USB Audio 2.0 class complaint driver.  That covers 98% of the computers and tablets on the planet.  I would challenge your assertion that we are not class compliant simply because it doesn't work they way you expect on Linux.

This is the first you have mentioned the actual issue of the wrong channel count.  How many channels are showing on your computer?


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Thank you,

David A. Hoatson
Lynx Studio Technology, Inc.
Co-founder, Chief Software Engineer


Posted By: JohnWalker
Date Posted: September/22/2016 at 6:57am
David,
the Linux system log reports the following:
dmesg -e output
[Sep21 22:05] usb 5-2: new high-speed USB device number 2 using xhci_hcd
[  +0.532469] usb 5-2: New USB device found, idVendor=247f, idProduct=3231
[  +0.000005] usb 5-2: New USB device strings: Mfr=28, Product=27, SerialNumber=1
[  +0.000002] usb 5-2: Product: Lynx Hilo
[  +0.000002] usb 5-2: Manufacturer: Lynx
[  +0.000002] usb 5-2: SerialNumber: 3200722110
[  +0.024634] usb 5-2: __uac_clock_find_source(): selector reported illegal value, id 40, ret 6
[  +0.000005] usb 5-2: parse_audio_format_rates_v2(): unable to find clock source (clock -22)
[  +0.001748] usb 5-2: __uac_clock_find_source(): selector reported illegal value, id 40, ret 6
[  +0.000673] usb 5-2: __uac_clock_find_source(): selector reported illegal value, id 40, ret 6
[  +0.000005] usb 5-2: parse_audio_format_rates_v2(): unable to find clock source (clock -22)
[  +0.054691] usb 5-2: __uac_clock_find_source(): selector reported illegal value, id 40, ret 6
[  +0.000964] usbcore: registered new interface driver snd-usb-audio

aplay -l output:
card 3: Hilo [Lynx Hilo], device 0: USB Audio [USB Audio]
  Subdevices: 1/1
  Subdevice #0: subdevice #0

There's a lot more stuff from the verbose diagnostics which I can email or Dropbox if you wish. I've used other USB devices by Focusrite and M2Tech without trouble. I'd certainly appreciate your spending some time on this.

Wikipedia quotes figures by Gartner which says that 54% of all devices now in use worldwide run Android - another important OS for the future?


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Retired UW acoustics engineer


Posted By: JohnWalker
Date Posted: September/22/2016 at 7:08am
There's a small but significant difference between the Hilo serial numbers. Linux (dmesg) returns 3200722110 whereas the Hilo's status page gives 3216082110 for the LT-USB card. (The difference is 15360000, which looks as if it might mean something to a programmer).


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Retired UW acoustics engineer


Posted By: JohnWalker
Date Posted: September/22/2016 at 8:39am
Here's a link which you might find interesting - the Royal Navy has also tried to follow this model for the past 10 years or so. http://www.public.navy.mil/subfor/underseawarfaremagazine/Issues/Archives/issue_37/HowAndWhy.html" rel="nofollow - http://www.public.navy.mil/subfor/underseawarfaremagazine/Issues/Archives/issue_37/HowAndWhy.html


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Retired UW acoustics engineer


Posted By: David A Hoatson
Date Posted: September/22/2016 at 9:33am
I saw nothing in the log about channel numbers.  Just clock sources, which to the Hilo-USB mean absolutely nothing since it should always be on internal clock anyway.  The serial number reported to USB is a non-issue since that isn't used for anything.


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Thank you,

David A. Hoatson
Lynx Studio Technology, Inc.
Co-founder, Chief Software Engineer


Posted By: JohnWalker
Date Posted: September/22/2016 at 2:34pm
Errrmm....the Hilo screen's 'About' page reports a firmware date Feb 17 2047; the Windows 'Hilo Remote' app reports the firmware date as Jan 12 2000. Neither date makes much sense. Is there something  wrong with the way numbers are being handled by Lynx's own software?


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Retired UW acoustics engineer


Posted By: David A Hoatson
Date Posted: September/22/2016 at 4:00pm
OK, that is a very small issue.  Hilo Remote was updated a while back to handle 2016 serial numbers properly and the next revision of Hilo firmware will correct the about box.  How does this have anything to do with the topic?


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Thank you,

David A. Hoatson
Lynx Studio Technology, Inc.
Co-founder, Chief Software Engineer


Posted By: JohnWalker
Date Posted: September/26/2016 at 8:52am
David,
I see numbers displayed incorrectly/inconsistently on the device's own status screen. It seems natural, then, for me to ask you, as the developer,  to check whether there might also be errors in numeric information sent from Hilo over USB. That's all. Asking me whether it is relevant or not sounds, well, passive-aggressive. Sorry, but it does.

I've subscribed to the Linux Audio User group and am awaiting confirmation of membership. Once that is received, I will send information from the debug tools.


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Retired UW acoustics engineer



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