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Forum LockedLynxTWO sounding too sharp and having no lows

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van Caine View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: LynxTWO sounding too sharp and having no lows
    Posted: January/19/2016 at 10:56pm
Salute! I have a wee bit of a problem here - on my LynxTWO-based (B, I think. Six out/2 in+2/2 digital) Windows 8.1 studio-computer, the sound is behaving very weird. Here, the sound is very bright, and lacking the meaty lows completely. On my other computer, standing right beside it but having a cheap but pure S/P DIF-sound card and Windows 7, everything sounds just dandy. They both share the same digital Sony amplifier for headphone references.
At first I thought it might have to do with Nuendo, and for a time I tried to compensate for it. Then I realized for sure that the simple audio-cutter I use for editing field recordings sounds more or less the same, so the problem obviously must reside in the computer, card, or system. Come to think of it, I remember when upgrading the system from XP to Win 8 (64) the first place I did notice a change in sound. What gives here you reckon?
I can't remember how it sounded before, but though the LynxTWO-card does indeed seem to fight with my BlackMagic Intensity-card, I don't think the sound went weird when I installed the video-card, but I know for a fact that I reacted to the more detailed sound in Win 8 Pro.
I tried to remove an option called "Topology Driver" in the settings, and I THINK that did the trick for a while! But I'm not sure. Might have been stress-ears talking there, but I actually think it worked for a while.
Not now though. Whenever I try to disengage it, the computer flips me the bird and turn it on instantly again.

For reference, this is mah gear here (haha): PC with last generation Intel Core2Dou/Gigabyte motherboard, LynxTWO, Intensity Pro PCI, Windows 8.1 Pro, Nuendo 7. Granted I do not know how the sound-engine of a soundcard works, I might have missed something that affects the sound, if so, do tell & I'll find out what I have.
I can work with this, have done several big gigs on this system since the upgrade, but it's very frustrating and takes time, and everything else is awesome otherwise. Surely there must be a way to get the system totally bit-transparent?

Thanks in advance, Christian van Caine
Pax Vobiscum! Christian
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/26/2016 at 2:02pm
All of our drivers are bit perfect, and driver or OS versions shouldn't have anything to do with sound quality. You're referring to the Digital Out on the LynxTWO or the Analog Out? The digital is just data so has really nothing to do with sound quality (other than perhaps jitter). 

I would check the Lynx Mixer: Mixer > About. 
Make sure that the firmware on your card is revision 16. If it is older, it might not play nice with your GigaByte motherboard. Problem is, you should probably have it installed in a different motherboard when you run the update. If communication fails it could brick the card and will need to come back to us for reprogramming. 

There are no settings that really have anything to do with sound quality in the Lynx Mixer, so if there is an issue we'll have to look at the other conditions involved. Are you using the ASIO drivers with your audio software? 
Paul Erlandson
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van Caine View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/11/2016 at 11:20am
Good morning and thanks for the reply!
I actually managed to fix this eventually. I have no clue why this happened, but while combing through the system after what it was making my poor card acting this way, I realized there was an option called "Show hidden devices" in the window where I choose what soundcard output to use for the system. I checked it and...suddenly I saw a new thingy called something like "Lynx Sound Device" or similar (my system is in Swedish whether I want it to or not, but roughly translated). And it was disabled.
I enabled it and...presto - problem solved! The sound I knew and loved was back in all its meaty and balanced glory!
Weird thing is, before that I made numerous different tests to figure out what was wrong, and recording AES/EBU Digital Out directly short-circuited to Digital In first resulted in a completely flat response in Room EQ Wizard set to ASIO, then later to a very tilted one. I couldn't test it in S P/DIF as I don't know where my adapter cable for Digital In hides right now, but I bluntly assume there shouldn't be much difference. I can't remember which one I did an internal routing on in the Lynx Mixer, I was pretty stressed, but I assume it might have been one the tilted ones (did a lot of tests). Trying to set REW to Windows native drivers made the entire system fritz out completely on scanning.
Not counting that Nuendo never has been WYHIWYG (though pretty close in version 7), trying to record audio in the regretfully only Windows-driver-capable WaveShop still gives pretty weird results, and I have no clue if I still have remnants of the problems I had before, or if this is related to the program itself - I have no way of testing that right now - but in short, trying to record something in 96 or 192KHz 24-bit makes the Lynx Mixer telling me it's really set to 44.1KHz/16-bit, and judging by the sound, it isn't lying....
Playback seems to jive well though!
Pax Vobiscum! Christian
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/11/2016 at 4:18pm
Not sure what to make of all that, but glad things are sonically sorting themselves out...
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van Caine View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/05/2016 at 4:00am
Regretfully, not quite. The lack of beefy bass was for some reason due to the S/P DIF-output messing with the amp I used. Dunnu why, doesn't make much sense as I've never heard of that kind of meta-data before (none of the other devices connected to the same amp acts that way), but that I could fix by turning off the stuff definitely that it activated. That way I got the low sub-bass, but the low-mid down to upper bass still refuses to play ball. Mostly. Which is seriously confusing....
Sometimes, especially when switching between drivers, things seemed to sound okay.

I now know for sure that it is neither Nuendo nor Windows that acts up on me, to be able to finish my current gig I had to switch to an old Firewire Focusrite-card (box), and with the exact same monitoring system, the problem is gone for now.
One thing I noticed when trying to work with this card is that the sound sounds like there was some kind of extremely high-frequent phasing in it of a kind I've never heard nor heard of before. It seems to act much like some kind of exciter, while scooping and mudding up the higher low-end a lot. It is also in that area that the phasing is really identifiable, though it also makes filter-sweeps pretty interesting. I can't examine this closer until this job is done, but my impression of the sound is that it sounds like two totally identical signals in tandem with only samples delay between them, and no feedback at all. Audio mainly in high frequencies sounds extremely clear, but anything even remotely fat sounds damaged.
Of course I make sure to listen to the sound without allowing any form of loopback patching, neither from the input channels nor via the programs outputs, though it does sounds like the phasing might be depending on both processor-load and whether it's ASIO or DirectSound.


Edited by van Caine - March/05/2016 at 4:06am
Pax Vobiscum! Christian
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/08/2016 at 1:19pm
Since the digital out of the LynxTWO doesn't touch samples, either the Digital transceiver on the card is bad, or the issue is in the software domain, or some interaction (maybe voltage disparity?) between the source and destination. 

Directsound is not bit perfect, so you might test with ASIO or using our Lynx Demo application to play wavefiles. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/08/2016 at 1:32pm
Make sure that Emphasis is turned off for the Digital Output.  Your external device might be seeing that bit turned on and applying a de-emphasis filter.
Thank you,

David A. Hoatson
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van Caine View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/11/2016 at 12:46am
Paul: Actually, both the analogue and digital out seems to sound exactly the same as far as I can tell, and all my listening goes through ASIO, except I had to change to a program called WaveShop for simple editing until I can renew my ancient license of Wavelab again. Bit-transparent but freeware and extremely simple, including the settings. This problem might have been with me for quite some time, but I blamed my DAW, and my monitoring-system was calibrated for each room. 
Lately is the first time I've mixed through headphones though as I'm between studios right now, and it's not really worth it to treat the place I have now as I'll leave it as soon as I find a bigger more undisturbed place anyway, so I brought a very neutral and trustworthy digital/analogue Sony amplifier here for secondary HiFi-monitoring and primary headphone amplification. With the headphones (Sennheiser HD600 and Beyer DT250) the weird phasing is much more audible now, and since Nuendo version 7, Steinberg really got so much closer to bit-transparency (still not quite cigar, but I like it!). As what I do must be transferable to everything from iPhone speakers to full-on cinema speakers, I have a lot of different machines connected to the same system for reference, including consumer stuff as PS3, PS2, and two different iPhones, and good stuff like my video workstation, the DAW-computer, and an old Atari. Being able to shift between stuff on the same listening-system made the error-search much easier, and I could pinpoint exactly what differs between the signals without having to do that at home, with a delay.

I'm a wee bit stressed right now as I'm about to wrap up a gig, but as far as I can tell right now, it might just be the outputs that are affected. I'll do a check with my old fat JUNO-60 and Ensonix SQ-80 after this gig to see what happens, but I expect them to sound just fine right now.
While searching the net for possible solutions I've realized there has been quite a few people who has had some issues with the double buffering, and the fact that both the analogue and digital outs seems to behave the exact same way, my uneducated guess would be that the error must reside somewhere within the translation/distribution from purely digital data to what will finally emerge as audio. Are there any possibilities that the two buffers can get misaligned with each other in some way and hence create this weird shift?
Is "Memory Read Multiple" the same thing as double buffer?


David: Ah, makes sense, although it doesn't change this problem I'm afraid. I got well confused when trying to change that and the sound only got muddier! I misunderstood it as that the card would emphasize the signal, but that being purely meta-data makes a whole lot of sense!


Edited by van Caine - March/11/2016 at 1:15am
Pax Vobiscum! Christian
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